Being fired at 50.
My husband was fired about two weeks ago. Not for doing a poor job in his position. Not for not making the company profits, but for being too old. This happened the day before his 50th birthday. Not only did they fire him for being too old, they haven’t paid him his last paycheck, which is sure to have and has had financial repercussions. They’ve begun already but we’ll survive them. We have to admit this is a first. Being in construction, he has been laid off and so on because there just weren’t enough jobs to go around, as new construction waxes and wanes with the economy, but being fired is a new one, especially for the reason he was fired. The person who did the firing told my husband he wasn’t impressed with his 30 years experience in the field, having only 3 years of his own experience as not even considered an apprentice craftsman, yet, and numerous courses under his belt as well.
Now, in a slow economy, it really doesn’t make sense to fire one of the very few people in your company who has the knowledge and experience to bring in a construction project on budget and with a healthy profit, but that’s what this company did. Oh, the new owners of this company are young, too. When my husband contacted one of them about his being fired, he was told it “was probably best because they wanted to build the company around people their own age.” This was when he also found out the person who fired him had been promoted to Field Supervisor.
All they have left now are young people. Young people with lots of book knowledge and no practical experience. Oh, one other thing they did was they doctored my husband’s last time sheet to say he quit voluntarily in spite of the fact that he was fired in front of witnesses. This will prevent him applying for unemployment benefits. Why would they do that, you ask? Because they have to pay the insurance and it goes up if there are a lot of claims against them.
Can we say lawsuit? Actually, yes, we can. Will we? Probably not. Yes, it’s been a demoralizing experience and yes, it is hitting us a bit hard in the financial department, but in the end, there’s no amount of money that will repair the damage done. In the end, the damage the company has done to itself will be more than enough reparations but that’s another story and not really worth telling.
Welcome to the left. The way this company is being operated reminds me of the Democratic Convention and the happenings around it. I’m not watching live but can’t help but be inundated with video clips and parts of speeches and so on. Everywhere you look there are young people with lots of education and no practical knowledge, but easy to control. They believe they are liberating themselves while signing on to government control. Every censure they commit will, in time, be committed against them tenfold. When they realize what they’ve done they’ll chafe against the bonds to which they willingly submitted but there will be no other recourse as they are bent on destroying the greatest democracy on the face of the earth.
For a good idea of how the young left thinks, here’s This.
Just like there’s no amount of money to repair the damage done to us in terms of self-worth and other frustrations with which we have been beset, there is no amount of money that will repair the damage done by people who will advocate and force upon us a system that has failed time and again throughout history. They will work to hide the bad parts while talking about how they will save this nation’s soul and make the world what it should be. They talk about change as if it’s some miracle that will happen the day Obama is elected to the presidency. Without practical real world knowledge, I suppose it’s easy to buy that notion. However, those with real world knowledge know that change must come from inside firstand is usually commiserate with life experience. Only children believe it just happens magically. I know, raising my own children, that this was a reoccurring thought process. They believed that when they became a certain age, they would magically be imbued with all the knowledge that other people of that age have; that they didn’t have to listen to older and wiser people who have already experienced what they are about to experience. It never worked out for them that way, which they slowly realized over time as the knowledge never materialized at the magic hour, no matter how often they wished for it. It’s called growing up. I’m unsure why some believe it would work out for a nation in that manner. Perhaps because they haven’t learned that lesson, yet.
One could respond to this by pointing out that you have to let them learn from their mistakes and I agree with that to a point; the point where their mistakes can do irreparable harm not only to themselves but to others. Before that point is reached, those with more knowledge and experience have a duty to interfere and prevent the harm from happening, in spite of the fact that we’re hated and reviled for it.
Unlike waiting for future vindication against that company who fired my husband for being too old for them, we can’t allow the attrocities of total government control to happen because, once done, it will be impossible to undo without a complete dismantling of the country and starting anew.
So, we fight and continue to fight against such encroachment. In the end, we may lose as it seems we have steadily been losing to a larger bloated and ever greedier government, but that doesn’t mean we stop fighting. If we stop fighting, we’ll surely lose and the result will be untold suffering. I can’t live with that on my conscience. How about you?
Crossposted to: Hillbilly Politics
Posted by Stephanie
August 27th, 2008 at 11:15 am
Stephanie, I am very sorry about your husband’s job loss. That age bracket for a man, to be told you’re not needed, is very hard emotionally (aside from the other things).. It was difficult when my husband had to retire from being a military pilot after 20+ years but at least he had retirement to fall back on until he found a new permanent job… You put everything just beautifullyl in the comparisons and I could not agree more. Trusting that things will move along to finding new employment..
August 27th, 2008 at 11:19 am
Kay, he already has new employment. A little less pay but not so low we can’t deal with. It’s the parallels that struck me as a teaching moment. Thanks for your thoughts and goodwill.
August 27th, 2008 at 11:50 am
Shitty
August 27th, 2008 at 12:02 pm
Well, yeah, it was, but the left would have you believe it’s good policy considering they do much of the same things within the government. Isn’t John McCain too old to be president? Don’t they hide the bad parts of their governing history?
We’ll move on from this, but will they? Not likely.
August 27th, 2008 at 12:14 pm
Well, those young guys won’t always stay that age, will they? I wonder how they’ll feel in a few years when someone ditches them. Good about the job! My husband did manual labor until he found regular employment post-military retirement… You do what you have to and at least there’s employment, the main thing.
August 27th, 2008 at 12:14 pm
It’s a disgrace what those men did to your husband, Steph, and I do believe we reap what we sow.
Years ago I worked for a lab that ‘cooked the books’. I didn’t know it until I took over management of the reports - and saw the invoices - which went to FEDERAL clients. I immediately put a stop to it, generating only billable results and meeting the bottom line with productivity instead of phony billing. Then I took a vacation.
When I came back they were back to their old ‘bilk the government’ to pay their bills. Only five reports had gone out in two weeks. I put my foot down and told the lab owner that I would not falsify those invoices - which was not only fraud, but a federal crime, including mail fraud if they go through the mail.
I was given the choice of being a crook or keeping my job. I quit.
They went on their merry way until they got caught, fined and put out of business. I think one person did go to jail.
The bottom line is that sometimes God takes us out of these situations and it doesn’t seem like the best thing at the time. I believe that you and your husband are wise enough to find the way out from under the mistakes these ‘adult children’ made when they fired him. I don’t believe, however, that those people have the character to come out from under their own errors - sort of the moral of your post.
Having to work for them must have been a real pain in the backside for him. Young know it alls.
My mom told me a story that applies:
There were two farmers who lived side by side. One farmer was a Christian who worked hard, night and day for six days, and he went to church and rested on the Sabbath. His neighbor worked night and day, seven days each week. He cornered his Christian neighbor and chided him for taking a day off each week - “Look how much more you could get done if you didn’t quit on Sundays.”
The Christian just smiled and continued with his routine. “It’s in God’s Hands” he said.
At harvest, the Christian neighbor did not produce as much as his neighbor who gloated “I told you not to take Sunday’s off - what do you say about that?”
“I say that God doesn’t settle all His accounts in September.”
God bless you and your sweetheard, Steph. I know there are better things ahead, and you’ll come out on top. You can’t keep a good man down.
August 27th, 2008 at 12:25 pm
Thanks, Kathy.
One point, although it’s a natural mistake considering the industry. The owners are two women who took over the family business from their father. They’ve never worked in the industry, although I do believe one was once a runner up in a beauty contest. They took some business classes.
We’ll have a rocky few weeks having income cut like that until we get all caught up again but we’ll pull out and he’ll be alright, too. He has a good reputation in the field, if not with “that” company. He’s worked under so many of the general contractors that he’s well known as the “go to” guy when nobody else can figure out what went wrong… and they’ve let him know that, too, in the last couple of weeks.
August 27th, 2008 at 3:50 pm
File for the unemployment. You may lose, but you may win. You have witnesses - and perjuring oneself is not to be taken lightly. At the very least, you’ll have their behavior on record.
There sure are a lot of jerks in the world.
By the way - be sure and keep track of the company. Sounds like it’ll be in the ground or up for sale in a year or two. Let us all know if you could use some investors!http://hangrightpolitics.com/smilies/yahoo_love.gif
August 27th, 2008 at 3:53 pm
I worked for a family owned company for 4 years after retiring from the AF.
I learned something very valuable. If I owned any kind of company, I would not allow family members to even enter the company to visit, much less inherit it.
If one want’s to create a small failing business, give a large succesful one to your family.
On the bright point, I finally had enough of it and had to make a decision about my future, so went to work as a supervisor in a school district, and was able to retire after only 14 years. Hope your husband has the same good luck.
August 27th, 2008 at 6:00 pm
It also seems like a case of age discrimination to me…. I think you should file and see what happens.
August 27th, 2008 at 6:17 pm
We’ll see if any lawyers bite. The thing with lawsuits like that is it feels like a continuing of the demoralization of the whole thing and you have to wonder, in the end, is the money worth it. Now, I’m not rich or anything but there are some things worth more than money even to some poor people (financially poor, that is) and one of those things is self-respect.
Initially I was pretty angry over it and thought the same thing but you know, when lawyers start going at it over stuff like that, sometimes it just seems to make things worse.
August 27th, 2008 at 8:02 pm
Steph.
The reason I would never sue anyone about anything is:
I cannot stand to think a lawyer would make $1 on my account!!
August 27th, 2008 at 8:32 pm
In small claims court you don’t need a lawyer. Back in the day when I was a newlywed, enviroguy and I rented a house for a year - when we moved out it was spotless, but the landlord held our deposit. First it was a stall - pay you next week - for two months… Then we filed with small claims, had to go to court and have friends swear to the condition we left the house (they’d helped us move). She confessed that she’d spent the deposit and didn’t have the money, so the small claims court reminded her the deposit was an escrow and she wasn’t supposed to touch it - but nevertheless she made a payment schedule and it took 2 years to get our $600 back.
Needless to say, no interest.
Was it worth it - well were so broke we needed the money - even the extra few dollars helped. But it wasn’t worth it.
August 27th, 2008 at 11:30 pm
“But it wasn’t worth it.”
Which is exactly why so many a$$holes get away with treating people as badly as they do. They know that for many people it just isn’t worth fighting back.
Some fights are worth fighting, just so the other party can learn that you can’t always treat people badly without consequences.
My dear wife likes to remind me that everyone gets their just reward or punishment eventually. I agree. But I also think that sometimes you have to stand up and fight so that you can be around to see the payback when it arrives.
I friend of mine was a landlord in town. He had a renter skip town in the middle of the night after they had completely trashed the house they were renting. He had their $1000 damage deposit but it cost him almost $15K to repair the house. He tried recovering the damages but the renters had left the state and when he did track them down they scoffed at his threats to sue them. So he did it. He was awarded damages by the courts but the renters had no regular employment income to garnish and they immediately left that state. So he hired a private detective. It cost him even more, but for the next 5 years every time this couple tried to rent a place to live the pictures of what they did to his house were sent to the potential new landlord.
He said later that it was worth every penny to know that those leeches spent over 5 years living out of their van because no one would rent them a place to live.
August 28th, 2008 at 4:14 am
Kathy , eventually they’ll have to send his paycheck under the law. If they don’t, hubby has another option before court, which is put a lein on the construction project until he gets paid. The GM on the project isn’t going to stand for that. He’ll get his paycheck… eventually. I was addressing the discrimination side of it. He has a clear winable case for the courts but is it worth it in the end?
August 28th, 2008 at 9:58 am
David,
It wasn’t worth it to me to spend hours preparing for a lawsuit, hours and hours in court, and the shame of having to ask my friends to testify to my cleanliness so that I could get less than $30 per month pay back.
The problem with the system is that it does NOT protect anyone who doesn’t have the money to protect himself (as your landlord obviously did) and those who need small claims to settle things are usually trying to get blood out of a turnip.
August 28th, 2008 at 10:42 am
Nobody likes getting fired from a job, especially one in which that person contributed so much of their own life and expertise. It’s depressing. I quit a job years ago for the simple reason that insider politicking and toadies got some people promotions that they not only didn’t deserve, but whose arrogance and incompetence contributed to lowering morale with the rest of the company workers.
It was tough after working for over 4 years believing that you could climb that pyramid where, with hard work and dedication, one could gain a position of importance and responsibility commensurate with one’s skills and diligence.
I live in Texas and I defy anyone to walk into any major housing or shopping center development and demand to see how many Mexican workers are here illegally. My own observation of those installing the rebar and concrete slab foundations on up to the completion of a building project, is that 95% are Hispanics. If you want a Day Without A Mexican, you better be prepared to quadruple your costs and expenses. Chance are, however, if you made that challenge openly, you’d likely be beaten to a pulp.
Getting fired or downsized, however, isn’t confined to one political party’s policies or dominance. Corporations’ obscene profits and CEOs’ bloated salaries and bonuses always come at the expense of ordinary working Americans.
These corporate mavens love the political elections because it takes tremendous heat off of their own bad decisions which have cost our country capital and jobs. Better to blame politicians than to be accountable to anyone. After the elections are over, it’s back to the same-old, same-old gridlock and paralysis.
The inescapable fact is that America’s growing population, now around 305 million people (third highest in the world behind China and India), will always have needs far beyond government’s ability to meet those growing responsibilities. Most Americans, at least from my experience, know the value of hard work and innovation.
If one job doesn’t work out, you move on. When you look back on it, you may find that the loss of one job opened up an opportunity where misfortune can result in something positive.
August 28th, 2008 at 10:43 am
David, this particular company will get its comeuppance. Trust me on this. As I said before, hubby is well known in the industry here in Nashville, not just the electrical side but the overall commercial/industrial construction industry. This company has more more project to finish and nothing else on the books… nothing. They won’t finish the existing job on time with the people they chose to keep on payroll because none of them have the right experience to finish the job. At that point, under contract they’ll have to pay liquidated damages meaning a $337/day penalty until the job is done.
The estimator quit just before hubby was fired. He had submitted a total of 15 bids none of which were awarded although the numbers from 5 of those were shopped out to other electrical contractors. What does that tell you? General contractors are leary of the company because of their attitude and incompetence. Hubby went out one night at 10P and didn’t get home until after midnight… on a Friday night because their top hand walked off a job and said there was nothing he would do until Monday after he was the one who caused the mess in the first place. That’s the kind of attitude that is left at that company.
So, what kind of future do you predict it will have with those kinds of practices?
August 28th, 2008 at 10:46 am
Kathy,
I understand where you are coming from. You just re-enforced my point that so many people in this world get away with stuff because most decent folks just do not think it is worth the time, the shame, or the hassle of the fight. Most crooks who take advantage of people count on that kind of thinking. I myself have walked away from several confrontations similar to yours because the gains were not going to be worth the cost of the battle. I’m not proud of that. Now in my later years I look back and wish I had fought some of those fights. Which is probably why I am more willing to fight some of them now.
Does it make sense to spend a dollar to win back a dime. Usually no. But is it worth 90 cents to sometimes send a message to a jerk that they do not deserve the dime they stole. Sometimes yes. It depends on the individual and the circumstances.
As for my landlord friend. He is not rich. He is a little better off than many of us, but still middle class. It is just that his sense of justice often overwhelms his sense of fiscal responsibility. Besides if I rented out a house to someone who tore up the carpet and chopped a hole through the slab in the living room so that they had a place to drain the oil from the motorcycles they were repairing. Who owed me three months back rent and who smashed every light fixture in the house, then plugged up the drains, turned on the water, and left in the middle of the night. I would probably be pretty pissed off also.
August 28th, 2008 at 10:46 am
Nobody likes getting fired from a job, especially one in which that person contributed so much of their own life and expertise. It’s depressing. I quit a job years ago for the simple reason that insider politicking and toadies got some people promotions that they not only didn’t deserve, but whose arrogance and incompetence contributed to lowering morale with the rest of the company workers.
It was tough after working for over 4 years believing that you could climb that pyramid where, with hard work and dedication, one could gain a position of importance and responsibility commensurate with one’s skills and diligence.
I live in Texas and I defy anyone to walk into any major housing or shopping center development and demand to see how many Mexican workers are here illegally. My own observation of those installing the rebar and concrete slab foundations on up to the completion of a building project, is that 95% are Hispanics. If you want a Day Without A Mexican, you better be prepared to quadruple your costs and expenses. Chance are, however, if you made that challenge openly, you’d likely be beaten to a pulp.
Getting fired or downsized, however, isn’t confined to one political party’s policies or dominance. Corporations’ obscene profits and CEOs’ bloated salaries and bonuses always come at the expense of ordinary working Americans.
These corporate mavens love the political bickering because it takes tremendous heat off of their own bad decisions which have cost our country capital and jobs. Better to blame politicians than to be accountable to anyone. After the elections are over, it’s back to the same-old, same-old gridlock and paralysis.
The inescapable fact is that America’s growing population, now around 305 million people (third highest in the world behind China and India), will always have needs far beyond government’s ability to meet those growing responsibilities. Most Americans, at least from my experience, know the value of hard work and innovation.
If one job doesn’t work out, you move on. When you look back on it, you may find that the loss of one job opened up an opportunity where misfortune can result in something positive.
August 28th, 2008 at 11:06 am
Steph,
It sure sounds like your hubby is better off out of that company, as x4 says, this change may lead to something positive.
Integrity is not something you can train, it is there or it isn’t. It’s also something you can’t whip out of someone. My guess is that company is going to cut some corners and Steph’s guy is better out of it, cause he sure wouldn’t do what they are planning to do to stay afloat - if indeed that is the plan. Maybe they are trying to bankrupt the business…. sure looks that way.
David,
Yup, I’d be mad about those damages too. Too bad they couldn’t be thrown in jail for that much damage. Don’t laws on vandalism apply? It was criminal, whether there is a law on the books for that or not.
My husband went after our exlandlord on principle. In the end we had more principle than money for the effort. In the case where the fence contractor took our $1000 prepayment and skeedaddled to another county (Denver county was prosecuting him so he moved to a different county) my husband decided the small claims approach was less than satisfying, so he took a college buddy and went to the guy’s (new) office and offered to take it out of his hide. The crook produced $800 from his pocket - that’s all we ever got back - but it was faster and easier than waiting for the courts to do their jobs.
Sometimes it is useful to remind people that even if they put you in jail, they’ll have to do it from the hospital, and that you’ll be out of jail before they are out of the hospital.
Just sayin’.
August 28th, 2008 at 11:46 am
August 28th, 2008 at 12:07 pm
“My husband went after our exlandlord on principle.”
Speaking of principle, I terminated my Directv satellite service after it was confirmed that the satellite dish bracket came loose from our roof. During a heavy rainstorm, water leaked through and began leaking into one of our bedrooms.
All I asked for was for them to send one of their repair technicians out to tighten the brackets and reseal the holes that they drilled during installation. They refused and told me I was responsible for “early disconnect” fees of $66.28. On the phone, I got a very rude individual from “customer service” who told me I had a roof problem, not an equipment installation problem.
After they mailed me collection agency threats, dozens of phone calls, my letters to Directv offices in Westbury, NY, Englewood, Colorado, Phoenix, Arizona and their main office in Colton, California, numerous letters to the Better Business Bureau plus copies of all correspondences and complaints to the Texas State Attorney General’s office, Directv sent me a short two-line statement that disconnect fees have been waived and there was an apparent mix-up in communications.
Was it all worth it? Yes, to me it was. I can just imagine the millions of dollars these hardball tactics that companies use to intimidate and harass people into paying up regardless of the justification for customer complaints. Sometimes these small victories are sweet.
August 28th, 2008 at 12:15 pm
“My husband went after our exlandlord on principle.”
Speaking of principle, I had to terminate my Directv service after it was confirmed that the satellite dish bracket came loose from our roof. During a heavy rainstorm, water leaked through and began leaking into one of our bedrooms.
All I asked for was for them to send one of their repair technicians out to tighten the brackets and reseal the holes that they drilled during installation. They refused and told me I was responsible for “early disconnect” fees of $66.28. On the phone, I got a very rude individual from “customer service” who told me I had a roof problem, not an equipment installation problem.
After they mailed me collection agency threats, dozens of phone calls, and after I sent letters to Directv offices in Westbury, NY, Englewood, Colorado, Phoenix, Arizona and their main office in Colton, California, numerous letters to the Better Business Bureau plus copies of all correspondences and complaints to the Texas State Attorney General’s office, Directv sent me a short two-line statement (after 3 months of this idiocy) that disconnect fees have been waived and there was an apparent mix-up in communications.
Was it all worth it? Yes, to me it was. I can just imagine the millions of dollars these hardball tactics companies use to intimidate and harass people into paying up regardless of the justification for customer complaints. Sometimes these small victories are sweet.